All right. Good evening. Welcome to our September 4th Design Review Commission meeting. Can
we begin with a roll call? We can. As I get my clocks out here. Chair Case. Here. Vice
Chair Newsom. I am here. Commissioner Weingarten. Here. And Commissioner Basting. Here. I'd like
to introduce Commissioner Karen Basting, her first meeting. Welcome to the Design Review
Commission you know it's I went in different order there no all right so
next we'll move on to consent calendar so this is an item that may be moved by
the Commission secretary when it's expected to be routinely approved without
discussion or debate and the item we do have is the adoption of the minutes from
June 19th 2024 so I took a look at those they look good to me so I will make a
motion to approve those meeting minutes. I'll second. Chair Case. Yes. Vice Chair Newsom. Yes.
Commissioner Weingarten. Yes. Commissioner Basting. Yes. Motion is carried. Okay so now
we'll move to public communication so this is for items not on the agenda. Do
we have anything this evening? Okay seeing nothing we'll move to public
hearings and we will start with our only item for this public hearing which is
This is project 2890 North Main Street freestanding sign.
Do we have a presentation from staff?
Awesome.
Chair, vice chair and commissioners.
My name is Stephen Cook.
I am an assistant planner with the city.
This evening we are reviewing application number Y24-018,
which proposes a new freestanding sign
at 2890 North Main Street.
The property at 2890 North Main Street
is an existing office commercial building
located at the intersection of North Main
and Treat Boulevard.
It is a zone service commercial
and is surrounded by various commercial uses
to North, South, and West.
Interstate 680 is located directly adjacent
to the property to the East.
This project involves converting
an existing freestanding structure
into a new freestanding sign.
The existing structure will not be modified
in height, size, or material,
rather signage will be directly installed
onto both perpendicular sites.
The requested signage requires two exceptions
to the sign ordinance.
One to increase the allowable sign area
and another to increase the allowable
address lettering height.
The project was reviewed by the Design Review Commission's
sign sub-committee.
The sign sub-committee supported the proposed design
without recommending any modifications.
They concluded that the proposed free-signing sign
and the two requested sign ordinance exceptions
were reasonable as they would enhance both
site and tenant identification.
The sign ordinance requires that new
signing signs meet the required finding as listed. As previously mentioned the
sign side committee was ultimately supportive of the freestanding sign and
believe that the project satisfied this finding. Given the site's location at a
busy intersection the sign will enhance visibility for both the site and its
tenants. It will be clearly visible to motorists on North Main Street and
Treat Boulevard. Staff is confident that the design review commission can make
the required finding. Sign ordinance exception number one allows the proposed
freestanding sign to exceed 25 square feet of total sign area.
The proposed sign has a total area of 54.88 square feet,
but 27.44 square feet on each side.
Typically, for freestanding structures,
with two parallel faces displaying the same content,
only one face is counted in the sign area calculation.
However, since the proposed structure has perpendicular
faces, each face is treated as a separate sign area.
The address 28 North, 28 North Main is not included
in the sign area calculation as it is the required address sign.
The two faces are necessary for wayfinding purposes
that assist motorists navigating
through a busy intersection.
Staff is supportive of the sign ordinance exception.
Sign ordinance exception number two allows the proposed
freestanding signs addressing numbers
to exceed 18 inches in height.
The proposed address numbers will be 30 inches tall.
The large size is intended to enhance visibility
to passing motorists making it easier to identify the site.
The increased letter height facilitates quicker recognition of this address.
Staff is supportive of the sign ordinance exception.
Staff recommends this project is exempt from CEQA review under Section 5301
of the CEQA guidelines, Class I existing facilities.
Staff recommends the design review commission to move
to adopt the attached draft resolution granting approval
of the 2890 North Main Street freestanding sign, application number Y24-018,
subject to the conditions contained therein.
That concludes staff's presentation.
I'm available for any questions you may have.
Additionally, the applicant is present and is also available for any questions you may
have.
Great.
Thank you.
So before we move to questions, has anyone had any ex parte communication on this project?
No.
No.
No.
Great.
Does anyone have any questions of staff or the applicant?
None.
Okay.
So at this point, I'll open it up to public comment.
Is there anyone in the audience who would like to make a comment on this project?
Nobody is running forward.
So with that, any comments from our commission or does anyone want to make a motion?
Okay.
I can make a motion to approve this project.
I saw it on signed subcommittee and it still looks great.
So I would make a motion to approve with the language that was on the previous slide.
So with the stipulations mentioned in the staff report
Point of clarification with the conditions in the resolution. Yes. Yep. Thank you. Second. Oh
Chair case. Yes, mr. Basting. Yes vice chair Newsom. Yes, Commissioner Weingarten. Yes. Motion carries for
Awesome at this point. We'll move on to Commission considerations
And I'm excited to hear about the new aquatic and community center at Heather farm Park
the design development presentation package.
I need to ask about ex parte on this one too.
Oh yeah, I guess so.
No, it's not.
No, commission considerations.
So, good evening Chair Case and members
of the Design Review Commission.
It's my first time ever being at your commission
and I've been here for 30 years.
So, pretty exciting time for me.
My name is Kevin Saffee and I'm director
of the Arts and Recreation Department
And it is an exciting time, yes, for the city of Walnut Creek
and for this project, the Heather Farm Park.
So if you can believe it, the community center
and the pool at Heather Farm are more than 50 years old.
You would believe it if you saw it in person,
you would know that.
And for the last 15 years or so, this has been a priority
of the council and the community to do something different.
And so really only until the last five years
when we started to familiar with the Your Parks,
future project, was really a lot of energy put behind this.
And then with the past Measure O in 2022, we really had money to do something.
And so that's when energy and momentum really got going.
And so tonight we're going to present to you some very specific areas of design and your
input and feedback and comments are very important to us as we take this to the next stages,
which I'll explain in a second.
So again, Kevin Savine, Arts and Recreation Director, I'm joined by two members of our
Nolan Tam team, Jocelyn Lawrence-Barrish and Elaine Forbush.
And then from our RM Landscape Design team, Gian Chavez.
So they will be here to explain to you some of the specifics about the project, and I'll
walk through what we're doing today.
So why are we here?
We are now at the design development phase of this project.
When we last saw you, again, I wasn't here, in January, we talked very broadly about this
project and got some very good feedback from this commission, which I'll explain in a second.
Now we are very much focused on a couple of areas here that we want your input on.
One is the landscape plan and the planting palette, and the second is the exterior building
materials palette.
And we have images that we want to share with you and a palette we want to share.
So you are the experts, and so we're going to look to you for your input on that.
So what are we doing today from members of the public?
We'll walk through the presentation of the design development presentation package.
We'll take your questions, and we'll stop at each section so you can give us feedback
on a couple of different areas.
We'll take public comment if there is any, and then we'll seek your feedback as we go
into the next stages.
So I will provide the overview and background on this project.
The design team will talk about the design development presentation package, and then
we'll talk about next steps, and we'll wrap up from there.
So in terms of background, why are we doing this project?
What's the council's priority here?
Three things.
One, as I said, this is more than 50 years old.
So replacing that aging aquatic facility and community center and the direction we got
from council is to combine them into a new facility at the same location as the existing
community center in the park, such one, one and two.
So we're replacing them and we're combining them.
And then the third is we're replacing three pools, which is what we have today, at the
the Clarkson Center with two pools at the new facility.
One is an Olympic size pool, 50 meter pool,
and the other's a family recreation pool.
Principles, so what guided us
and continues to guide us through this project,
I'm not gonna read all these,
but this is a visual asset that only hands the park.
We're looking to prioritize the existing programs,
as well as providing opportunities
for the possible expansion of programs.
The third is we are improving the function of these spaces
be current. This facility, while it's 50 years old, was really designed probably closer to 55 or 60
years old, so things have changed significantly from them. We are providing support spaces,
maintenance and otherwise for the facilities, and views. Views from the facility looking out,
and then views into the facility looking in. So, timeline. I talked about the Year Parks,
Your Future project started in 2018. A lot of analysis. We looked at lots of different
facilities throughout the city, not just at Heather Farm, we looked at Civic Park,
we looked at Chaitland's. Council narrowed down to where do we want to
spend our energy and time, which is on Heather Farm. So we started the
conceptual planning process in 21 and ran that through January 23, and then the
design process started in 23, which is community engagement. I'll talk about
that in a second. Sequo documentation bringing us up to schematic design and
then design development today. And then our plan is construction starts a year
from now, maybe a little bit less, take us two years.
So 2027, we will have a new facility open for the community
and other farm parks.
That's the timeline.
In terms of outreach, I'm just giving this
as background for you.
There was extensive outreach done as part of this project.
We had one significant open house for the community.
We had a number of pop-up events,
things like First Wednesday,
which is one of the downtown's event, Farmers Markets.
We did an online survey.
Over 1,000 people responded to that survey.
We've had commissioned council meetings
and we've had stakeholder meetings.
I'll talk about that too in a second.
So in terms of public meetings,
we met with you in January,
we met with the pros commission in February,
and then we had council meetings,
three of them, February, March, and April.
So what did you tell us back in January?
This is in your report, I won't go through all this
in detail, but you provided comments and feedback
on things such as the site plan, the roof,
the traffic circulation and flow, parking,
the pools, the exterior surface materials,
and the ceilings and windows.
So we took that feedback as we went to the PROS Commission.
And then the PROS Commission feedback and your feedback
we took to Council in March and in April.
And so what do we do with that as far as summary goes?
We looked at the site plan and the roof massing.
We looked at the queuing and drop off.
We work with the Aquatic Foundation,
which is the nonprofit group that's raising money
for the pools and had an agreement with them on the design.
We've looked at the materials palette for the exterior
And then we've looked at shade.
Shade is very important to the community,
especially in Walnut Creek,
especially in the summer, especially outside.
So council received that,
gave us direction to move forward to design development.
That was in April.
So a lot has happened in the last six months or so.
So we had stakeholder meetings, I'll summarize that.
And then we have this meeting this evening,
we go to pros on Monday, then we go to council in October.
So a lot has happened,
and a lot will happen in a fairly short amount of time.
So that's why your feedback tonight is very important.
So stakeholders.
We had two separate meetings, one with the group of environmental organizations, and
the second with the aquatics groups.
Environmental groups were the Gardens at Heather Farm, the Mount Diablo Bird Alliance, and
the Open Space Foundation, and the Friends of the Creek.
And the aquatics groups were represented there, which is more of the pros conversation on
Monday.
So, what did we hear from those groups?
They had some suggestions about their planting pallet related to trees.
You'll hear about that tonight.
They had suggestions about bird safe glass in the facility.
Interest in mitigating, as much as possible, noise from the pool deck.
Teams had interest in power, Wi-Fi in the pool deck.
And then if you're familiar, there are two very significant, maybe three very significant
events that take place at the pool every year.
One is the all-city swim meets, which happens in June, 1,200 or so swimmers over the weekend.
It's a big deal.
So interest in supporting that event in the future.
And then the Wanakook Aquanuts has two big events, one that just took place this past
weekend where they're looking to make sure the new facility supports that as well.
So in sum, all the stakeholder groups were satisfied with the design, the materials,
and ready to move to public meetings, which is what we're doing this evening.
So I'm going to turn it over at this point to Jocelyn, who's going to talk about the
design development presentation package related to the entire project.
And then you'll toggle back and forth with Gina, we'll talk about the landscape.
And then I'll come back later to talk about next steps.
I do want to stop there just for a second
and see if there's any questions about background process,
how we got to where we are today.
And if not, I will turn it over to Jocelyn.
I have one question, just a basic question because I'm new.
The existing pool complex, the existing aquatic center,
is that going to remain open?
And OK, well, it's under construction.
Yeah, good question.
Thank you.
That's one of the reasons why, and we'll show you
the site plan in a second, the reasons why we're
looking to build it at the site we're looking at,
which is where the existing community center is,
rather than the existing pool site.
So we can keep the pools open.
Fingers crossed we stay open for another two or three years.
It's old, but that's the intent,
is to keep those pools open,
running until we open a new facility.
And then, this question may come up,
it comes up a lot for me.
Another conversation we had with the community,
and bodies such as yours,
about what will we do with that site in the future,
where the pools are located now,
so that it has not been determined yet,
but we're gonna keep those pools running
as best we can for the next three years.
So thank you for your question.
Good evening.
Okay, so I'm going to give you a fairly high level view
of the site and the project,
and move on to the specific areas
that we're looking for your feedback on.
Hopefully this was something you could digest
a little bit in your packets.
So within Heather Farm Park,
hopefully you're familiar with that,
we are, as Kevin said,
using the site of the existing community center,
the existing community center will be demolished,
and a small portion of the pond will be filled in
to accommodate this site.
It needs a little bit more space
than what's currently there now.
Some mitigations will occur to offset that pond infill.
The two pools will be to the south of the site
and the combined aquatic and community center
in a single building slightly to the north of that.
And so specifically, we're looking to make sure
that the pond experience is actually enhanced to some degree
by completing the path all the way around the pond.
of right now you've got to sort of jog through the community center to make that circuit.
Trying to make sure the experience of driving through North San Carlos Drive is preserved
along with the bike path adjacent to it, that pedestrians still feel like they're
welcomed to and through this site, that as Kevin mentioned views of the park are taken advantage of
as well as views of this community center are well considered and that as best as is possible
the somewhat noisy pool activities are sequestered from the other noisy activities within the park
and that the quieter activities are set mostly aside from those. So within the site itself,
hopefully you had a chance to look at all of these amenities, I'm going to gloss over them
a little bit quickly since which amenities where is not exactly the focus of our meeting this
evening, but we do have quite a lot of use of indoor-outdoor connections since we have a lovely
climate here and a really beautiful park setting to take advantage of and there
is a heavily studied drop-off and parking sequence. Everyone of course would
prefer to have, you know, tons of parking and drop-off everywhere at all entries
and exits but this is a fairly constrained site so the best has been
done with what is available. A lot of folks have studied that and that
includes some emergency vehicle access that's had to be thoughtfully
integrated with the park experience since we don't want necessarily to have
large typical fire lane you know heavily demarcated red zone kinds of
things laced throughout the park experience and in addition to having to
also thoughtfully work in maintenance access to the pool decks. Within the
building itself it's arranged so that the north side of the building has the
community center functions housed within it and the south portion of the building
has the aquatics functions in blue and red.
So the large bar to the north contains
what's gonna be the newest iteration
of essentially the lakeside room as it used to be.
Still will have a view of the pond
and has about the same seedy capacity
with the exception of now there's a partition
so there's a spillover to a slightly larger anti-room
that can make the room slightly larger in capacity
than it is now but also has kitchen functions,
furniture storage, et cetera, all the things you need
to have a large rentable conference room, ballroom,
reception room kind of experience.
There's one additional meeting room
for the community center function,
but actually even then to the south on the aquatics wing,
there's what's called the aquatics classroom.
So, truthfully, there's three smaller multi-purpose rooms
that can act as programmable classroom space
jointly between the aquatics and community center functions.
And then the middle bar contains some back-of-house
spaces, a large restroom bar, and the administrative spaces
for the community center staff.
And those areas to the south that are in blue,
there is actually a slightly separate volume
off to the right there.
That's the changing room.
And it was actually a suggestion of one
of the pros commissioners that we
try to make it as close to the entrance as possible.
To do that, we had to break it away from the main volume.
Because the functions on the Aquatic Center side
really want to be on the pool deck.
all of them want to be on the pool deck,
so it was a little hard.
We had to figure out how exactly to get the most real estate
to be on the pool deck itself.
And so you'll see there's a generous entry
so that when there are larger events,
you can open the gates,
and many people couldn't come through
onto the pool deck at once,
but the rest of the time it can be controlled.
There's those aquatic center,
administrative spaces and back of house spaces,
and then, as I mentioned, that classroom,
which can either function as a sort of classroom
where you would take an arts and rec class,
or rentable space where you could have folks
that wanna have a pool party and a place
where they can go off and have separate space
for their party that's not on the pool deck.
And I will now hand this over to Gina
who'll talk about the plants that are gonna go in here.
Thank you, Jocelyn.
So I'm Gina Chavez, good evening commissioners.
I'm with RRM Design Group
and we're the landscape architects on the project.
And we've been working on this project since 2018
when we were looking at all the parks and chose this one.
So we're very excited about it.
I'm going to talk a little bit about how we came
to the planting pallets that we have here,
and then Jocelyn's going to walk us
through the perspective renderings,
which really show that character.
So when we were choosing the plant pallets,
we were guided by a few different principles.
One was we wanted to reflect the character
of Heather Farm Park, which is a mix of different styles.
It has like this beautiful picturesque setting
with the rolling lawn areas
and the large mature tree canopies.
and then it also is balanced
with the more natural vegetation
of the reservoir to the north
and the riparian corridors around the park,
and then also the borrowed landscape
of the hillsides that surround the park.
So we wanted to reflect all of that in our design
and really make that a part of the character
of the facilities.
So we divided the plan up into three,
into different communities based on the use zones,
and I'm gonna talk about those in a couple more slides,
but we also worked really closely
with the public works staff to make sure
that we are selecting plants that were maintainable by them
so that we're drought tolerant
and we tried to use native plants as much as possible
and just plants that required minimal maintenance.
So one of the things we considered was locating plants
to be located so that they're not growing together
so that at installation time we consider their mature spread
so that we can avoid maintenance in the future.
So, as Kevin mentioned,
shade is a very important part of this project.
We all know how hot it gets out there,
especially on that west side
where we're gonna have some of those event spaces.
So, we worked with the public work staff
to choose trees based on maximum shade canopy,
as well as the maintenance aspect that I just talked about.
And then finally, also, we selected some accent trees,
which really show that pop of color in the fall and spring.
Sorry, I should have switched slides a couple seconds ago.
But that's what this plan is showing.
So those different green trees are the shade canopy trees.
The blue trees show some of the shade trees
that are a little bit more functional
in the aquatic center.
So we worked with the public work staff
to choose a tree that had very minimal leaf litter.
And one of the complaints that we heard
was that at Clark Swim Center,
they have a lot of issues with the needles
of the redwood trees getting into the pools,
and to the system.
So we chose a tree, it's called Tristania conferta,
for those of you who are interested,
that has larger leaves and tend to fall less.
And then finally, some of the accent trees we chose
were based on flowering color as well as fall color.
When creating the plant palettes,
we decided to sort of arrange them
into these three different categories,
based on those aspects that I spoke about
within the park itself and the surrounding landscape.
So we have what we're calling the mixed upland community,
and that's that green space that you see
in the plan diagram.
And then we have the riparian community,
which is the blue space in the diagram.
And then finally, the orange space is characterized
by your more urban, tough, durable plants,
and that's for the aquatic center.
So within that mixed upland community,
we have three different spaces.
We have the arrival court, the private entry courtyard,
and then in the back, the garden event space.
So within these, we're trying to pull out
those characteristics of the upland community, which
are the large shade canopy trees.
And we chose the Coast Live Oak tree, which is also
within Heather Farm, as well as around the surrounding
hillsides.
And then we also chose grasses, and boulders, and native ground
covers within those spaces.
But in the event garden, we chose a little bit more
of a different palette.
We did incorporate some of those elements,
but we wanted it to feel more ornamental in the event space.
So we chose a darker green palette
with some softer gray tones and textures.
And we chose white flowering plants
so that the flower colors don't conflict with any event space
colors, for example, for a wedding.
And then, OK, so then the next palette
that I wanna talk about is the rye pairing corridor palette.
So that's the blue space again.
And this one is characterized by, again,
grasses and native ground covers.
But also we wanted to have a bit of a pop
of more of a creek corridor tree color.
And that's where we've included the ginkgo.
We have heard some comments from the native plant community
that they would prefer a native tree.
So we're sort of working on that with them.
The reason we chose the ginkgo was that it resembles the poplar
tree, which you find along Creek corridors, but it can have very
invasive shallow roots, so it's just not practical for an urban
setting. So we're still working on that. And then in the aquatics
area, we have those tougher durable plants like the Tristania
Conferda, some of your very durable low shrubs and grasses, and then
we're selecting a species of turf that really tolerates high
activity for those spaces for people to hang out in around the pool area. I'm
going to turn it back to Jocelyn now, who's going to talk. All right, so
we're going to stop here for questions before we get into the fun graphics of
the perspectives. Pause for questions. Any questions so far? We will have
opportunity for comments. Any questions? I had a question but you sort of answered
it. I wanted to know how much how many plants were California natives
basically. How much of the project would be native species? So we haven't quite
refined the entire list yet. We have this palette but we're still adding plants. So
we talked to the Native Plant Society and they would like to suggest some more
plants that are endemic to Walnut Creek. So they've offered to give us a tour and
so we would like to add some of those plants as well but we don't have a final
count yet. We are trying to use them wherever possible though. Great, thank you. Sure.
You sparked me. I have a question. I did note somewhere in the pre-material that you're
upgrading to a lead silver target, is that correct? Equivalent? I see. Okay, and then the
planting and all of that I assume has alignment to that equivalency. Can you talk a little bit
about that, in terms of water usage and retention?
Yeah, so all of our irrigation design is water-efficient.
The plant material is low water use.
We're replacing a lot of turf out there, so we are actually reducing our water use.
And I'm not sure exactly how that plays into the lead silver selection, but that's always
part of our design.
That's been part of the goal from the beginning, with the landscape palette.
Great.
So I'm gonna hold public comment until we finish the whole presentation. Cool.
Thank you. Okay so we have actual physical versions of these. I have my
lovely assistant pass our tray to you. You can pass them along to each other.
Since as you know a digital version of a material is never the same as the
physical one. So we've got two palettes. We would love to hear your input when we
get to the comments section about which of the two palettes you find preferable.
Staff's recommendation is palette A. In both cases there is a use of wood in
quite a lot of forms, especially around the shading structures that we've got as
you'll see in the perspectives. There's also stone-like tile. Stone itself is
very expensive, as you probably know, so we've got stone-like tile that allows
is to still have a natural feel, and also as heavily durable in water-rich environments,
which the Aquatic Center will have.
And there's also the use of quite a lot of metals in places where the water will not
be quite as much of a problem for that particular kind of material, and then there's also some
concrete masonry unit block, masonry block, so that in the places where we really need
the most hardiness of materials to withstand water impact we can we can
have that as well so there's a few other accent materials you can see them in the
tray I'm gonna maybe just wait on this ball to pass the tray around since those
materials are worth looking at worth spending time you'll see that A and B
actually do share some materials some some are a given no matter which palette
we want to go with. But the real difference between the two is A has a
lighter stone to it and, excuse me, B has a lighter tone to it and A has a darker
tone to it. There may be a section that is composition, yes. So you can see that
we have a mix of a few nicer, more expensive, beautiful materials and then
some truly cost-conscious materials. This is a public project, we do have a limited
budget. We're doing our best. You'll see we're using these items creatively to
get the most impact out of the most expensive of the finishes we're using.
We're just talking through what goes where.
Then there are there are perspective renderings so you'll be able to see
these on the buildings themselves. I can go ahead with those. I can go ahead
with those. The last thing I want to say about these pallets before I move on
from the slide is that during the community engagement process, we did ask a set of specific
questions about the materials that the community wanted to see, and there was an overwhelmingly
strong response to have natural materials. Wood and stone and metal were the three strongest
responses that we received, and if we could do just those three, we would. We have some
other materials that act in a similar manner where we'll need to save cost.
And we are actually not we have just as Gina has not finalized the planting pallet.
We have not finalized the building material pallet.
We are in a similar process of figuring out exactly the extents of which materials we can afford where.
We do try to have the best visual impact that we can with the more expensive materials.
And we have to figure out exactly the extent of those.
So it's the current it's the current job right now.
Alright, so perspectives.
I'm gonna start with a couple aerials
so that you can see the building massing,
although that's not really the focus
of what we're talking about,
but it'll give you an orientation of what we're looking at
when we look at more street level views.
So this is a bird's eye view looking towards the east.
You can see the Heather Farm Gardens in the back.
And so the two gabled volumes
are that lakeside conference room that I discussed,
and then there's also an atrium that hinges
between the community center portion to the north
and the aquatics portion to the south.
The atrium is really meant to be like a public living room
kind of experience, and marries the two functions.
You see the pools off to the left.
And so when you have A and B palates,
B looks slightly darker, A is, I keep doing that,
it's B that is lighter, and A that is darker.
And it is a little bit of a squint and squint
and look at the difference, especially from this far away.
So the piles are very similar.
The main goal is to have this impact
of natural, stone-like material, wood, and metal accents.
And you would get that really either way.
So here we've got the opposite view looking west.
You can see Mount Tam sort of exaggerated in the background,
so you get the impact of what we're looking at.
And you can still see those two gabled volumes.
From this side, those multipurpose rooms,
you can see those are looking over the pond
with all of those exterior event spaces
adjacent to the pond itself.
You can see the pools a little bit more completely
and where they sit relative to the playground
that exists in there off to the right.
And then again, squint and you can just miss the difference,
but B is lighter and A is darker.
It's both the main tile,
which is echoed by a cement plaster color changes.
That's the thing you're seeing change the most
between the slides,
there's also a subtle difference in the wood which contrasts more for palette B
and for palette A is all the same kind of wood. You can see it's used at
vertical surfaces for shading as well as for trellises that are horizontal. The
metal is then mostly used at the at the wood obviously at many of the openings
and then also for the supports because the wood itself doesn't really want to
be down near the either the pond level or the pool level because of water
infiltration. All right so these are the views that are a little bit easier for
us to have an idea of how the building will feel as you interact with it. So
this would be the entry sequence where there's the entry courtyard that Gina
was discussing and the plants that are in her palette are used here in this
view and we're looking at that main atrium space that I discussed was
really this meant to be a place for all the public whether they are engaged in
classes or swimming or not this is a place that they can come in out of the
heat, and enjoy park amenities, restrooms, there's seating, it can be a place that informal
meetings take place, there are even sort of banquet kind of seats in there, but the idea
is that really it sort of be this sort of lantern-like presence that could collect folks,
and so it's therefore very transparent, but then palette A has the slightly darker tile
and the more even the wood that's all the same color.
So then you can switch back and forth
and see that you get a slightly lighter tone
and more contrasting woods.
A little harder to see on this face.
You can see it a little bit better and further on.
So here at the aquatics wing,
the use of the tile was actually started here.
You do need a very water durable material
for an aquatics building for obvious reasons.
Both the pool water itself is essentially like salt water
and how it behaves chemically.
And then they also have to pressure wash the area
on a regular basis.
So you're limited to tile or a concrete block.
And we wanted to use whatever materials were required here
in the rest of the building itself
so it doesn't feel like this aquatic swing
is sort of an orphaned extra separate different space,
but it's of a piece of the rest of the building.
And so the tile really felt like this more elevated material
that could have a civic presence.
But we did manage to bring the wood in on this side,
pretty much high up where the water won't be interacting
with it regularly at the underside of the soffits,
at the trellises, and at the wood slats
that forms sunshade screens on the windows.
So this is the place where you actually see
the most dramatic change from palette A to B.
A, darker, and B, lighter.
Although if you look at the volume,
it's the changing room volume,
all the way over on the right,
where you can see someone taking an outdoor shower.
That's where you can finally start to see
the contrasting wood difference the best.
You can see that wood got a little darker
on those vertical shade pieces.
And then this is the view as you're walking around the pond.
So we're looking at the lakeside room
where a wedding has just wrapped up, it looks like.
And the two multipurpose rooms further on,
you can also see some of the trees
that Gina was talking about.
You can see those ginkos down there
giving you that sort of riparian feel.
They're like the little baby poplars
that won't become big and disruptive.
Here's that difference between A and B.
Here you can also start to see the difference
in the contrasting wood on those vertical sunscreen elements
as well.
So the exact extent of what is tile and what
is cement plaster is not fully determined.
That's why those are colored very similarly.
That way we can compose them as economically as possible.
We can happily go back through any of those perspectives
if you have questions at this point.
Questions?
Yeah, I have a question.
So the tiles that are in the box, those are siding only.
They're not flooring tiles?
That's right.
OK, that answers my question.
I always struggle with questions versus comments.
I'll try to form this in a question,
and then we'll comment later.
I was really struck by the fact that the building that we're
replacing is 50 years old, which reminds us
that whatever we do today should be here for a long time.
And when we're asked to choose blue versus red
or beige versus white,
I think that what we're asked to do here
is not be just making a stylistic assumption.
So I'd like to under, my question is,
can you explain what your intent as the architect is
for the building and which pallet supports your idea
for the project?
I think the reason that the pallets are so similar
both of them reflect our intention. So our intention firstly is to do with
making sure that this speaks to what the community as a whole sees of itself and
wants more of in Walnut Creek because that this is a chance to have a little
bit of an identity making experience for Walnut Creek. We heard a lot from the
community that they felt that community that the community did not have a
distinctive look. There was no Walnut Creek look. So exactly how to do that is
subtle, I think, is the word I would look for and so we asked a lot of probing
questions during our community open house that were then reflected in the
online survey that we that we released and they had a lot to do with you know
do you want something that's more contemporary, something that's more
traditional. The other comment, so how that fell out was it was it was a little
bit of a tie and we dug even deeper to that to say you know what of the
a traditional look and feel appeals to you,
what of the contemporary look and feel appeals to you.
And it had to do with what we said
about the natural materials.
So we had a lot of images of built structures
to help prompt that question of these five,
which are your favorite?
And really, what we could see was
that people liked having more glazing like you
would have in a contemporary building,
not small openings buried under the way
you would have massive walls shading small windows,
that you would have in a traditional structure
for this climate, but that the gable shape
was a real preference, rather than something
soaring and swooping and expressive
like you would find in many contemporary buildings,
especially aquatic centers, that can be very wave-like
in their expressiveness, because that's where people
often with that theme and then why I sort of summarized extensive comments about what
was desired as that natural materials were desired is that what really bridged both those
who liked traditional look and feel and those who liked a contemporary look and feel was
the use of natural materials.
When the project was contemporary, but had a forefront of beautiful wood, beautiful stone,
those were the images that were chosen most often.
When the traditional projects also really celebrated the materials, had them on display
and beautifully arranged and emphasized, those were also chosen by the community most often.
So we felt like that was the through line
and that we've really tried to balance that line
between contemporary and traditional.
So there are very traditional gable shapes.
There are some slightly more contemporary
interstitial spaces that link them together.
The floor plan's a little bit more contemporary in nature
and that it's not rectilinear,
it's a fan shape that unfolds itself
to really take a dynamic relationship to the pond
to highlight that.
But that being said, then the wayfinding is also very simple.
The entrances are emphasized as best
they can be so that it's not a kind of contemporary building
that talks about the building first.
Instead, it tries to acknowledge its surroundings first.
And I would say that is a main goal at Nolandham.
You will notice that we don't have a signature Nolandham
style of building.
And that is because we seek first
to have the building do service to its community
rather than to our aesthetic desires.
Hopefully that's a good enough explanation for you.
So in picking the colors, like the materials, which you've
really, it's the tile.
It's dark.
It's light.
And I see you've got these three bars
that you're creating spaces.
And then there's these interstitial spaces
that create this experience of fan.
How much do you wanna emphasize the wood bars
with the gabled roofs versus the interstitial spaces?
Because that may help us decide which color
is more complimentary to the partee of the project.
I think the gabled spaces are higher
and more prominent for a reason.
I mean, the atrium needs to announce its presence
so that the public can understand
that they're welcome there regardless
of whether they're paying for a class or not.
And a similar thing is true of the lakeside room
for the opposite reason.
It needs to look out onto the park
and make itself part of the park as much as possible
so that it doesn't feel like a sort of separate place
that people can go do whatever they want,
but that they're holding their event within the park itself.
The interstitial spaces have a secondary wayfinding function.
It means that we can't, it's the, you know,
you'd like the secondary spaces to just be quiet
as much as you can.
But if you go back to this view,
sometimes that's just not how things fall out.
So you can see we're making that atrium very welcoming
by making it so transparent.
But what's the closest to your eye
when you're walking up to the building
is actually the administrative bar.
And so we're trying to make it beautiful and welcoming,
but not, hey, this is a volume you need to walk into.
So there's sort of, I would say, three tiers.
you've got your most important two bars,
and they've been demarcated by their height
and the shape of their roof.
The atrium bar, the lake side bar.
And then there's sort of a secondary set,
which is things that are so much in your face
that we're gonna have a large visual impact from them,
like the way that this administrative wing
is very prominently part of this entry court sequence.
Or if you go to this face of the aquatics wing,
This is, we worked a lot with the staff of the aquatics department to talk about that
we've faded them out in this view a little bit, but there's a pretty raucous pool, community
pool here, and they're actually trying to go for one of those play structures that's
a little bit more paying homage to that fact we're in a natural surroundings that have
a sort of agrarian past rather than have it be like all, you know, Mickey Mouse creatures
all day, which many of these structures can look like.
And this pool deck probably will rarely be this empty.
So there's a little bit of visual quiet that was really asked for and emphasized.
But these do have these sort of secondary functions that still need to look and feel
beautiful enough that we feel like this is a significant civic building.
And then the truly interstitial spaces are, for instance,
you can see it here best.
This north, where'd the pointer?
Is it this guy?
There.
This north bar, it's really got all of the truly back of house
functions.
That's where we can have the least amount of emphasis placed.
It's a building in the round almost entirely.
That north bar is kind of the only portion
that doesn't have a function
that has to communicate with the outside,
but you will still see that north bar.
I'm gonna go back quite a few slides.
Oh no, here you can see it quite well.
This north fire lane has the pedestrian path
that comes across the existing bridge
over the creek from the parking lot
and then out to the pond.
So there's literally no face of this building
that is truly unseen by the public.
So it means that we've had to say,
okay, there's the most glorious,
there's the slightly less prominent
but still needs to be welcoming,
and then yes, it's interstitial,
but it's still viewable kinds of spaces.
Does that help clarify?
We'll talk later.
Okay.
Other questions?
I think you mentioned that you're not sure at this point
about how much of these finishes you can actually afford.
So, how are you gonna decide,
like if you have to value engineer,
which every project, I do public building,
so every project has to be value engineered,
where do you start?
We have, you know, really in-depth spreadsheets
that we're working with our cost estimators on,
so that we're really deep into the weeds
on exactly the extensive each material we can afford.
And what happens if we have a 10-foot datum of tile,
what happens if we've got a four-foot datum instead?
we're looking to have as many alternates as we can stomach.
We don't like to have bad alternates, the ones that,
if it gets picked up, there are unintended consequences.
We do pretty much all public work,
so we understand the public-lobid milieu.
That means you need to have thought of all of the ways
that your alternates can affect your project as much as
possible.
So everything that turns easily into an alternate,
we do that, but the building materials themselves
don't make a great alternate.
So that's why it's been left to the,
figuring out the rest of that puzzle first,
what's the bottom line on what we can afford.
And obviously we go for as nice as we can
once all of the programmatic functions
have been taken care of
to make sure the building can do what it needs to do first.
Makes sense.
I see you have some core 10.
That's tricky to work with.
where do you have it actually?
We're currently thinking of using it
as the windows surround, so it's a rain screen.
You have to deal with the depth issue
where you have an opening and we won't,
we'll have a stand-in for it at the aquatics facade
where we'll have painted metal instead of cordon.
Good, that was a comment.
Well done, okay.
And I mean lastly, I think, you know,
you mentioned lead equivalent.
What does that mean?
What's the deliverable the city can expect
that regards? Yeah we understand that that can mean a lot of things. We take it
pretty seriously so we will we have filled out a lead checklist already and
we have the majority of our points coming in through a performative
building and energy modeling and you see those PVs pictured in the array it's an
all-electric building those get us a lot of points so we've got you know we had
our mechanical electrical plumbing consultants do an energy model for the
building to figure out what the building envelope targets
have to be.
That's not something that you necessarily always
do with the lead equivalency.
That's probably the largest portion of the budget
that we're spending on that effort.
And then in terms of deliverables
that the city can expect, it will be the lead checklist
with the modeling behind it appended to it.
We're probably not going to do the version
where we fill out all of USGBC's forms.
Because that alone takes quite a bit of effort.
Yeah, it does.
Thanks.
I had just a couple site plan questions.
So in one of the renderings in the background,
it's the D2.8 aerial west.
There's like an amphitheater looking thing
in the background, which would be like the...
right here, or right there?
The one in the back.
Yeah.
So is that a little amphitheater area by the pool,
or is it flat?
That is actually sloped.
It has a suggestion of an amphitheater that has been lost
to value engineering, and also the fact
that the staff did not feel that it
would be heavily utilized.
There's a second amphitheater space here
adjacent to the aquatics classroom.
Yeah.
I was actually going to ask about that.
That's the one that staff felt would be heavily utilized,
because it's adjacent to that classroom space.
So it can act as a spillover.
It's also where they would prefer to gather folks
instead of all the way out at the end
of the 50 meter pool deck.
Cool, okay.
And then on the site plan,
it calls out the shaded picnic area,
which I think is cool and great,
but there's a gate behind it
that looks like maybe it's got a wide pathway leading to it.
I was just trying to understand that area.
I don't have to go back,
which on the...
So shaded picnic area like bottom to the left ish,
and then how there's a gate and an opening near that.
That is a shaded picnic area for pool users.
Okay, and so the gate behind that is access for what?
That is for, it's dual purpose,
it's partly for pool maintenance,
so they can get vehicles onto the pool deck,
but it's also for when there are large events,
there will need to be larger openings
for egress and ingress.
Okay, okay.
Those are my questions.
Thank you.
Is there more to the presentation?
OK, so that's great.
There are actually a few more.
There are some interior views.
Cool, OK.
Here we go.
So even though this isn't the focus of our discussion
this evening, we wanted to let you have an idea of what's
going on in the inside.
This is a view of that Lake Soudroom.
So wedding receptions, retirement parties,
that kind of thing.
You can see on the inside, we're still
doing the same thing where we're using wood and metal
and natural materials wherever possible,
but then also using more economical materials.
And then this would be a view of the atrium.
Same thing where we've got exposed metal and wood trusses.
We're still walking that line between contemporary
and traditional.
And this is one of those multipurpose classrooms
we talked about.
In this case, it's the aquatics classroom
that would be looking out towards the pool
deck and that amphitheater.
Okay, so next steps,
and then we'll take more of your questions.
So we're gonna synthesize your feedback,
take that to the pros commission,
which is Monday as I mentioned,
and then we will take consolidated feedback
from your body as well as pros
and take that to council on October 15th.
Depending on how that goes with council,
we may go back again in November.
Our intent is to move toward construction drawings,
the bid process, and then have a contract awarded
by December of next year.
so we can start construction into the next couple of years
so that we can have a new facility in 2027.
And so, again, your input is critical and important
to this process.
And so, happy to take more questions at this point
and then turn it back over to you for public comments
and then more comments at the end.
Great, thank you.
Thank you, Tran.
Other questions?
I do have one more question, sorry.
What's the grade change between the landscaped area
and the like contained outdoor private event space.
Is that like up and above?
On which side?
On the non pond side.
Non pond side.
That's zero grade change.
Correct.
You can kind of see like a bit of it,
like a tiny bit.
It looks like there's a wall.
There, you can see it there.
Behind the ginkos.
Oh, right, okay.
Yeah, so that's all level
and we're actually using the grade that's there today.
But that wall is to provide like a little privacy wall
for private events.
So maybe you go in there before you go to a wedding,
you have like some photographing moments or drinks.
Okay, so it's all the same level.
It is the same level.
Okay, cool.
That was my question.
Okay, okay, okay.
At this point, we'll move to public comment.
So if anyone would like to make a comment on this project.
All right, and yes, thank you for filling out a speaker card.
So Jill Dresser.
Thank you, commissioners and staff and design team.
I'm Jill Dresser.
I'm a volunteer, both in the arts
and in a native plant garden in Walnut Creek.
I'm here to share my thoughts specifically
about the planting palette.
The current planting palette seems
to have been improved with more native plants
since I sent in my comments a few weeks ago.
So thank you for that.
I also wanna thank you for holding
the environmental focus groups
with different stakeholders.
I was not involved in that,
but thrilled to see that you did that.
However, I believe that there is more work to be done
with the landscape architects.
I couldn't tell who they were till tonight,
so now I know who you are.
The proposed tree schedule currently lists 47 trees
of which 37 are non-native.
That is 79% of the proposed trees are non-native.
The Brisbane box tree is personally unknown to me,
but there are 20 of them proposed,
and as they are a native of Australia,
they are of no ecological value to Walnut Creek.
I have a handout that I'm gonna give you
that offers native options for the redbud,
beloba, and crepe myrtles.
While I find the proposed trees scheduled
to be in need of the most improvement
from non-native to native,
there's also more work that can be done
on the shrubs and vines.
We're in the midst of a climate crisis.
The trees that are planted around this new complex will hopefully be around for generations to come.
What is planted matters.
The simple act of planting native plants in our yards, traffic medians, business parks, and public spaces like Heather Farm not only
conserves water and reduces harmful pesticide use, they quite literally support life.
I urge this commission to request that no one, Tam and the landscape architecture firm take the planting palette back to the
landscape architects to revise and replace as many our natives and native with native plants as possible. Thank you
Thank you
Anyone else like to make public comment on this project?
Okay, we'll close the public comment. Alright, so at this point
We were asked to provide our insights and feedback on the package presented
With particular focus on the updated site plan exterior exterior building materials palette and the plant pallet
So we're going to take it back to our Commission for comments
And that's it
When I said later and later's now
With respect to the
Material palette on the exterior, you know
I am really struggling to understand the formal clarity
of the proposed architectural intent
because I was hoping that the application of the materials
would bring clarity to what you were trying to achieve.
I really struggle with it because you have a plan
that is seemingly three bars
and then two interstitial spaces,
but the application materials don't seem to discriminate
between what's a bar and what's a space.
And they're used ubiquitously across all of it.
So it starts to muddy the concept, in my opinion.
So that's why I'm struggling to make an assessment
of the materials because of how they're applied,
not necessarily what material you chose.
I mean, I would say functionally you've done,
it's a good job, I mean, it meets the program,
it meets the community requirements,
things are adjacent in the right ways.
But now we're into the aspect of it,
which I would say is really the design.
And I know that this is the design review committee
and I just feel so strongly that this is the only
or one of the only forums where we as a community
can talk about design.
And I don't wanna shortchange anybody,
but I certainly don't wanna belabor everybody's evening.
But that's where I'm at.
I can't understand the fact that there's these three bars
and one has a big high gable, but then the other one does,
but it's not a bar, it's a space.
And then the tiles seem to go on all of the surfaces.
There's just a lot going on.
I mean, it's really a classic kind of,
almost like figure ground problem.
What's figure, what's ground?
And I'm confused by it.
And I think just applying the materials
all over the place, it's really hard for me
to decide which one's the right one.
I could certainly, in a vacuum,
maybe have an opinion about darker versus lighter.
The other thing I'll say is that,
We can't tell what these materials are,
especially in this light.
And I would ask the architects to really stand behind,
having looked at the materials in daylight
as they're going to be viewed in the location on site,
which is so much different
than the quality of light in this room.
You know, what you recommend, you think would be the best.
I really worry about the lightness
of the lighter materials
in the hot bleaching sun of Walnut Creek.
I think the whole building is gonna wash out,
which adds another layer of importance to again,
that clarity of how they're applied
to reinforce the architectural idea.
So I'll pause there, it's just a comment,
it's very difficult to, you know,
because of that lack of clarity.
That's very, very interesting
because your take on this is totally different than mine,
but I think I could probably rift off that a little bit.
I think my issue always is what are we gonna end up with?
because we're not sure exactly how many of the materials
are that can actually be afforded.
So I think, riffing off what he said,
I mean, I think there's an opportunity there
to think about how much wood you can actually afford,
because that's probably the most expensive thing.
The tile's expensive is maybe,
when you have to scale these things back,
scale them back in a way that provides the clarity,
if that helps.
I mean, I think, and again, because I've done this so long,
I mean, I think probably the roof,
what is the plan roof of material?
Our goal, if we can afford it, is actually
to do a metal panel that, for all intents and purposes,
looks like standing seam.
We can't afford standing seam.
And if we can't afford the metal panel everywhere,
then metal panel will go on the low-slope roofs.
We have a couple areas that are mechanical wells that
are nearly flat and have to actually be PVC, TPO.
But there are a number of other low-slope roofs
that can't be asphalt shingles.
So those will be metal panel regardless.
And then if pricing forces us to,
we will do the asphalt shingle at the gable roofs.
I mean, I think from where I sit,
I think if you can see the roof, it matters, right?
And if that also provides clarity
between what's a bar and what's not,
I think if you have,
I don't believe having been in this park,
it's flat ground.
I don't really think you see most of those roofs.
Probably will be able to from the gardens,
from the guns at Heather Farm.
I mean, I think there's an opportunity to scale back
where you can't see it, I mean, frankly,
and put the punch where you actually can.
The punch meaning metal.
What you can actually, what can actually be red.
But in your opinion, metal over a slouch angle.
Oh, metal, yeah.
Yes.
Yeah, and I think it's all the time.
I mean, you can't do standing scene,
but you can probably do something.
Yes, we can probably do metal panel.
Looks that way, yeah.
What else you got?
Any comment?
I do, great.
So could you bring up Ariel East Palette A, please?
So I just wanted to take a look
at the administrative building,
which is, it looks to me like it's all in,
that's sort of the darker material block.
So to the right of the big gable, what is that one?
This one right here?
Yeah, that one.
That's actually right now clad in wood.
Okay.
Because it has such a prominent impact
on the entry courtyard.
So can you go to Ariel West, Paladay?
So I wanted to compliment whoever thought of the gable plan
because for me as a native of this area,
it's very reminiscent of Mount Diablo
and I love that about it.
That was the goal, actually.
Good, thank you.
So I think that answers some of the goal of the building.
And I also just wanna say I'm in favor of Palette A.
The stark contrast between the super light tile
sort of ages the building for me.
It's too stark.
This blends in and sort of meets your requirements,
blending in with the landscape
and the Walnut Creek sort of identity.
Thank you.
Okay, so last but not least.
So I preferred Palette A as well.
I'm just strictly basing that on my personal opinion.
So take that with a grain of salt.
I think it will be interesting.
I know we're not at this point yet,
but to also see how that plays into the paving
of the exterior spaces, right?
because I think, I responded that it feels a little warmer
and like a little more like it sinks
into the surrounding landscape,
so I think that will be a big piece of it.
I don't have any particular objections to the palette.
I actually think it's quite extensive,
so I appreciated seeing that.
I hear the comment from more natives,
and I think there's an opportunity
to look at some of the trees,
but I also wanna make sure,
and this doesn't mean they can't be native,
but I wanna make sure that there are some hardy,
very durable, can handle this kind of intense use space.
And I know that RRM is fully capable
of making sure it's those, but I think it can be both.
Those could be native, but I also,
it's important to me that this looks good year round,
and so it's gotta be a mix of things
that are visually appealing, and durable,
and low maintenance, and all those magical things
that are not always that easy to get in a palette.
I actually think the site plan and the layout of it
is pretty awesome.
I'm in this area quite often.
I hadn't quite perceived how close this was coming
to the playground, but I really like that.
My girls just started doing swim team
and having the like entertainment of both things
somewhat near each other is really helpful,
especially if it is kind of a party thing.
And I think the building is really cool.
I love the very big open spaces in the front
and how it does have a relationship
on both the entry side,
or the non-pawn side and the pawn side.
So that resonates a lot with me.
I also think that the path around the pond
is really important,
and I know that we had to kind of play
with those edges a little bit,
but that the fact that you guys kept that
and even gave it some of those little overlicks and stuff,
I think is really cool.
So I didn't get to see the previous presentation,
so it was fun for me to see this one live.
I think that's all I had.
I also took the online survey,
so it was fun to like kinda see how it applied.
So I was like, oh yeah,
I remember picking those different ones.
So that was cool.
Okay, yes.
Yeah, I got more.
Please.
You know, like I said,
all of those things that Commissioner Case just said are true.
But it's also true that at the end of the day,
this is a, that the project,
the design itself has to be more than that.
And I think that that level of intellectual order
or clarity of the design that's reinforced
on how you apply the materials is really important.
More so because of what Commissioner Newsom said,
you're right, the building has no back.
And if we smear the dollars all the way around,
it's going to be a disaster
because you will just have cheap on cheap.
And I really second the idea that that clarity
around the party of the building could help you focus
the valuable aspects of the materiality
in the right places because it's just too much surface.
There's so much going on.
There's a lot of ups, downs, ins and outs,
pergolas, overhangs, inverted slope grooves, gabled grooves.
I just think simplicity would help not only
with the clarity of how people perceive the project in this landscape in this beautiful
setting, but also in terms of the ability to do it at a cost point that, you know, doesn't
cheapen it in the end, right?
I don't know how you come back with that, but if you could think on that, and maybe
in the next presentation, you know, really be clear about what you prioritize in this
design, then we could, you know, hopefully the materials stand up to that.
Do we see this again?
It's not on the schedule for the DRC to see this again.
Or it will go to the pros and to city council
and they will have your comments.
I mean, I'll just say,
cause I'm not really good about giving positive comments.
I mean, I was here at the other meeting.
I think I'm the only one who was.
And I think they made the right choice
about which version to go with.
I think the plan is great.
I think a lot of the aquatic improvements are great,
I think there's a lot of pluses here.
I just think we just have to get real
about what could be afforded.
And when we do that,
we don't wanna lose the core value of this design.
And I think, and this happens all the time,
I mean, we all get excited about design
and we apply all these great materials around.
I think really it's just a matter,
when you have to pull back,
when you have to value engineer,
do it in a way that provides that clarity,
if that makes sense.
Is it significantly over budget right now?
I feel like we're determined that it is,
but I don't know that we know that.
Because you have a feel for what public buildings
can usually afford.
No, I would not describe it as significantly over budget.
But we are balancing the budget.
And I hope that Vice Chair, you can
see that the comments that you made last time
actually did get applied to the design.
The word chaotic was applied before
and our main project architect was in attendance
that evening and took it quite to heart.
I've uttered it several times.
That wasn't my comment.
No, it wasn't yours.
But so we do take your comments very seriously.
I think it's actually a great suggestion
that Commissioner Weingarten has made.
So even though we won't present to you again,
hopefully you'll see in the final building
more of the clarity that you're looking for.
Look, it's a process and I just wanna say again,
I love that we're having this opportunity
and thank you to all of you out there
who are either listening online or came tonight
because having debate about design is so important
and we get one meeting.
But it's a process of continual focus
and refinement and clarity.
And just if you thought it was complex yesterday,
it's probably complex tomorrow.
Keep working to simplify it.
Because as human beings on this planet,
I think we all perceive great spaces
And an architect's job is to figure out
how to get those great spaces.
Even if most people have no idea why they love something,
you'll often hear, and I hope they say it at this place,
I love going there.
It makes me feel good.
Why?
I don't know.
It's because someone took the time
to be thoughtful about proportion, height, space,
vistas.
All those things that we talk about
matter in the end on how people feel.
And this is our community pool, and this
is a great place to be, and it's in a beautiful setting.
And I just want the architecture to do no harm, if you will.
But just keep working at it.
Keep getting tighter.
We've got to do better than do no harm.
We could do better than that, yeah.
But you shouldn't do any harm.
Do no harm is a good bar to not fall below.
So I talked about the struggle.
And I think that if you were working on this,
you would immediately find the same struggle.
So we have the bars that have gables,
and we've got secondary multi-purpose rooms
that also need to somewhat announce their presence,
and then truly quieter third spaces
that are still visible from the exterior.
If you could wave a magic wand
and just tell us where you think
you want the most expressive materials to land,
where would you put them?
Your microphone's on, if you're gonna answer.
Okay, well, I'll just say it's not the role
the commission to design the project but um and with respect I totally agree
yeah this is the only time we're coming to you again before we get a council
which is a big audience and all that so we just thought since we're all friends
here if you choose to give us some of your feedback that would be helpful if
you choose not to that's totally fine but we just thought this an opportunity
and you're experts and we'd happy to take that feedback and input if you'd
like if you'd like I mean I in the spirit of we're all friends here you
I think the places where people engage the building the most, obviously the
higher-touch places need to need to give that that warmth and that comfort of
there's a quality here. It'll also aid in respecting the quality of the building.
You know it's a public facility, it's out in the open, you know I had these
nightmares about the lighter materials getting graffitied and all kinds of
stuff, so you can engender the kind of respect that we hope to preserve in this
community by by making those quality decisions around the places that are
really close to where people interact with the structure you know again for
me it's a it's a longer conversation about you know what's inside what's
outside what's avoid what's not and the way the materials go from inside the
outside it's unclear if they you know wrap in and continue into like the main
public spaces will those be the same quality of the exterior materials or we
just go into chipboard and you know plaster finishes and things. I don't know.
So the roofs do that, the walls can't afford to. Yeah. I do worry about the
Core 10 a little bit. I didn't realize there was Core 10. It you know it's it
sheds a lot you know and the last thing you want especially if you chose the
lighter stuff would be staining all over the place from the Core 10. Unless you do
it like Carlos Garfa. It's cool though. It's cool. I'd say the comment is
judicious use of Corten. Every time a Richard Serra sculpture gets moved it's
there forever on the ground. Which is kind of cool in of itself. I mean if
you look at it from that perspective no I mean the I think The Dark Hurtile will
help with that and we're also looking to use it in places that some of the
landscape where it can truly just weather away naturally and not stain
mulch. I guess I you know I'll just close by you know I guess I'm old school and
then I think less is more so whatever you can do to keep it simple. That's helpful.
I mean I think I liked what you said about the high touch spaces right so you
know where where people can actually see them and use them great I mean around
the side not as important and I like the idea of articulating the bars differently
than what we're calling the atrium's...
Yeah, I mean, it's because it's not clear
in how the materials are applied.
Sometimes they are using materials
to enclose the void spaces
instead of just letting them be the void spaces
between the boxes,
and sometimes it's the opposite, so...
I mean, I think that's a good takeaway,
is, like, how would you put that in a nutshell?
Go back to your diagram and just apply your materials
to reinforce the diagram.
So I would say it.
I understand that.
OK, all right.
Any other comments?
We really want to see this get done.
I just want to be clear on that.
Totally.
We're working tirelessly to make sure that happens.
Thank you.
I have one minor comment, which is just
keeping in mind what we're talking about.
This is a 360 degree building, and there are pathways
all the way around it.
So people will be seeing it.
We can't just cheapen up the backside, in my opinion.
There's no backside.
Yeah, there's no concept.
No, 100%.
That's why having clarity of the diagram
will help us put still acceptable materials, right?
But in a way that color codes this thing
that reinforces the idea would be helpful.
I think your comments on void versus volume
actually could help with that clarity you're looking for.
Yeah, I mean, it's because the main entrance,
the main reception is a void.
It is.
But the ballroom, I'm calling it a ballroom.
I don't know if it's a ballroom.
That thing is not, that's also a void, but it's also a bar.
So it's rendered as a void as the other one is,
but it's a bar.
So it's not the in-between space between two bars.
That's why it's confusing.
I see that.
That's helpful.
Thank you.
I also wanted to, I brought up native plants earlier.
So yeah, I'll bring that up again.
Yeah, I really hope that the city can commit
to a lead rating.
I'll just say for the record,
because this idea of equivalency is always a slippery slope.
And it seems, I don't know what the budget issues might be.
I'm sure there's some hesitation there,
but it just seems like we could do that.
And then I would love to know that everything
in the project from the landscape and the native species
and the water usage and everything is documented
and quantified in a way that really provides
most sustainable building. We have high sustainability goals within our firm
and as does RM, so we take that equivalency very seriously. I know
there's lots of ways to approach equivalency and we take it very
seriously. I mean I don't know, we're not here today to talk about UI or any of
those things, but I mean. We are studying that. With a building like this I would
love to know, especially in Walnut Creek, what the air conditioning load is, the
energy usage. Especially given the programs we have, you know, and we are
asking that people maybe reframe their their viewpoint on that by our design. I
mean we're not gonna make the changing rooms perfectly dry and perfectly
tempered. Yeah. Because that's very difficult to maintain the energy
consumption you want to target. Okay any other comments? All right do we need to
do anything further for this project? No we don't. We could call it a wrap on it.
There's no there's there's no vote, there's no decision, just recommendations
and I believe we've done that and we could move on to the next commissioner
member staff report announcements. Any commission member and staff reporter
announcements? Our fifth commissioner will join us at our next meeting that's
Commissioner Cricket Riley and she'll be present and that was supposed to occur
at the September 18th meeting but it looks like that meeting is going to be
canceled. Okay. We just don't we just we had to move some items around so there
will be the following meeting would be October 2nd but we we have not scheduled
a meeting when we did the schedule this year so there's only one meeting in
October and I think that's the 16th so it'll be October 16th so you've got a
little time if you want to you know schedule another vacation great yeah good
to know anything from commissioners announcements or reports okay then we're
All done, thank you everyone.
Thank you all, thank you guys.
Great, Christine.